• UK's north-south divide dates back to Vikings, says archaeologist

    From Steve Hayes@1:229/2 to All on Monday, October 16, 2017 06:50:16
    XPost: soc.genealogy.britain, soc.history
    From: hayesstw@telkomsa.net

    UK’s north-south divide dates back to Vikings, says archaeologist

    Watford Gap discovered to be key geographical divide between invaders
    and Anglo-Saxons

    Dalya Alberge

    Monday 16 October 2017 00.04 BST
    Last modified on Monday 16 October 2017 00.33 BST

    The north-south divide has been the butt of jokes in Britain for
    years, but research has shown the Watford Gap, which separates the
    country, was in fact established centuries ago when the Vikings
    invaded Britain.

    According to the archaeologist Max Adams, who made the discovery while researching his new book, the Northamptonshire-Warwickshire boundary
    known as the Watford Gap is a geographic and cultural reality that can
    be traced back to the Viking age.

    Adams was struck by the absence of Scandinavian placenames south-west
    of Watling Street, the Roman road that became the A5. “There might be
    one or two names, but I don’t think there are any, and there are
    certainly hundreds and hundreds north-east. Clearly the Scandinavian
    settlers stopped at Watling Street,” Adams said.

    “I began to notice that all the rivers’ sources stop pretty much on
    the line of Watling Street. North-east of that line, all the rivers
    flow into the Irish Sea or the North Sea. South and west of it, they
    all flow into the Severn or the Thames.”

    Map of Viking Britain

    He added: “Roman engineers constructing the route between London
    [Londinium] and the important town of Wroxeter [Viroconium], in what
    is now Shropshire, chose this ancient line, and it became Watling
    Street. In the Viking period it became the boundary for a treaty
    between King Alfred and the Viking leader Guthrum. Connecting the West
    Midlands with the south-east, it runs through a narrow pass between
    hills, the Watford Gap.

    “I’m not sure whether people on the north side of Watling Street immediately feel themselves different or whether that’s more of a
    southern joke. But clearly it’s a joke with a very old reality
    attached to it.

    “These days, we’re unaware of which way rivers face and where they
    flow out to. It doesn’t make any odds to us. We just put bridges over
    them. But, for most of history, such things have mattered. Your
    natural trading routes are along rivers and all the medieval monastic
    estates used the rivers as their arteries of power. So clearly the
    geography of power has always mattered … Geographically, it slaps you
    in the face as soon as you figure it out.”

    He explained that the Anglo-Saxon kings eventually fortified that line
    and made it a frontier in the early 10th-century reigns of Eadweard
    the Elder and his sister Æthelflæd: “So, in a sense, they reinforced
    the reality of that piece of geography and it seems to have been with
    us ever since.”

    “In 1959, when the M1 was first built, the Watford Gap was its end
    point – the butt of north-south divide jokes ever since,” said Adams.
    The M1 service station’s unofficial status as the country’s dividing
    point was celebrated in 2009 with the unveiling of a new road sign,
    with one arrow pointing north and another pointing south. Previously
    called the Blue Boar, the service station became famous as an
    early-morning hangout for The Beatles and the Rolling Stones, among
    millions of travellers who were fed and watered there. Linguists have
    since identified it as the boundary between northern and southern
    English.

    But boundaries are certainly blurred, Adams said: “We find it bizarre
    that, on the news last night, people were talking about Cheshire as
    the north … Routinely, politicians describe Hadrian’s Wall as if it
    was the border between England and Scotland. Well, there’s another 60
    miles of England beyond Hadrian’s Wall.”

    Adams has excavated widely in Britain and abroad, and he will include
    his research in a forthcoming book, titled Aelfred’s Britain: War and
    Peace in the Viking Age, to be published by Head of Zeus on 2
    November. It is a companion volume to his previous early medieval
    histories, The King in the North and In the Land of Giants.

    In the new book, he notes that, before the second decade of the 10th
    century was out, new fortresses or burhs were constructed at 19 sites
    strung out on a broad line between the Thames and the Mersey,
    unmistakable in their offensive purpose. That line roughly follows
    Watling Street.

    “It has an ancient and continuing geographic distinction, barely
    noticed by today’s midlanders. Broadly speaking, to the north-­east
    all the rivers flow into the Wash or North Sea on the east side, or
    the Irish Sea on the west. To the south and west every river drains
    into either Severn or Thames. This is England’s natural fault line,
    its continental divide: the watershed that divided and divides north
    from south (epitomised by the famous Watford Gap, on the A5/M1
    north-east of Daventry); and I have no doubt that Scandinavian armies
    and settlers knew its imperatives.”

    https://t.co/3vjGNfZr7H


    --
    Steve Hayes
    Web: http://hayesgreene.wordpress.com/
    http://hayesgreene.blogspot.com
    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/afgen/

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    * Origin: www.darkrealms.ca (1:229/2)
  • From Ian Goddard@1:229/2 to Graeme Wall on Monday, October 16, 2017 11:46:39
    XPost: soc.genealogy.britain, soc.history
    From: goddai01@hotmail.co.uk

    On 16/10/17 08:02, Graeme Wall wrote:
    On 16/10/2017 05:50, Steve Hayes wrote:
    UK’s north-south divide dates back to Vikings, says archaeologist

    Watford Gap discovered to be key geographical divide between invaders
    and Anglo-Saxons

    [snip article]

    Mr Adams is not saying anything new, I learn't about the Watford Gap and associated hills being the dividing line between Anglo-Saxon and Viking
    rule at school and the reasons why.

    The Danes & Alfred's Wessex, having fought themselves to a standstill,
    agreed this as a boundary with the proviso that Alfred agreed to keep
    paying the Danes not to overstep the mark. This was represented by
    Wessex as a great victory for themselves, the moral being that history
    doesn't have to be written by the victors. It's written by the
    literate, oral tradition isn't written.

    --
    Hotmail is my spam bin. Real address is ianng
    at austonley org uk

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From Graeme Wall@1:229/2 to Steve Hayes on Monday, October 16, 2017 08:02:47
    XPost: soc.genealogy.britain, soc.history
    From: rail@greywall.demon.co.uk

    On 16/10/2017 05:50, Steve Hayes wrote:
    UK’s north-south divide dates back to Vikings, says archaeologist

    Watford Gap discovered to be key geographical divide between invaders
    and Anglo-Saxons

    [snip article]

    Mr Adams is not saying anything new, I learn't about the Watford Gap and associated hills being the dividing line between Anglo-Saxon and Viking
    rule at school and the reasons why. He's also over-egging the
    north-south divide bit as it is more a south and west, east and north
    divide. There's reason why Lancashire and Yorkshire are traditional rivals.


    --
    Graeme Wall
    This account not read.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: www.darkrealms.ca (1:229/2)
  • From Steve Hayes@1:229/2 to goddai01@hotmail.co.uk on Tuesday, October 17, 2017 04:45:30
    XPost: soc.genealogy.britain, soc.history
    From: hayesstw@telkomsa.net

    On Mon, 16 Oct 2017 11:46:39 +0100, Ian Goddard
    <goddai01@hotmail.co.uk> wrote:

    On 16/10/17 08:02, Graeme Wall wrote:
    On 16/10/2017 05:50, Steve Hayes wrote:
    UK’s north-south divide dates back to Vikings, says archaeologist

    Watford Gap discovered to be key geographical divide between invaders
    and Anglo-Saxons

    [snip article]

    Mr Adams is not saying anything new, I learn't about the Watford Gap and
    associated hills being the dividing line between Anglo-Saxon and Viking
    rule at school and the reasons why.

    The Danes & Alfred's Wessex, having fought themselves to a standstill,
    agreed this as a boundary with the proviso that Alfred agreed to keep
    paying the Danes not to overstep the mark. This was represented by
    Wessex as a great victory for themselves, the moral being that history >doesn't have to be written by the victors. It's written by the
    literate, oral tradition isn't written.

    The Watling Street bit was rather new to me. When I was a student in
    Durham a fellow student told me "Wogs begin south of the Trent", so I
    thought of the boundary as a river, not a watershed.

    --
    Steve Hayes
    http://www.khanya.org.za/stevesig.htm
    http://khanya.wordpress.com

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: www.darkrealms.ca (1:229/2)
  • From J. P. Gilliver (John)@1:229/2 to hayesstw@telkomsa.net on Tuesday, October 17, 2017 21:08:27
    XPost: soc.genealogy.britain, soc.history
    From: G6JPG-255@255soft.uk

    In message <oje8uchisggpkp6oc9cl3894sqoab4m5nd@4ax.com>, Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> writes:
    []
    Adams was struck by the absence of Scandinavian placenames south-west
    of Watling Street, the Roman road that became the A5. “There might be
    one or two names, but I don’t think there are any, and there are
    certainly hundreds and hundreds north-east. Clearly the Scandinavian
    settlers stopped at Watling Street,” Adams said.
    []
    Strictly, the A5 _and A2_; I think it's from Dover _through_ London (A2
    in Kent, A5 the other side of London). There is certainly part of the A2
    in Rochester that is still called Watling Street; I think there are
    parts of it in Canterbury too, though the modern A2 bypasses Canterbury.
    --
    J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

    While no one was paying attention, weather reports became accurate and the
    news became fiction. Did not see that coming. - Scott Adams, 2015

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